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+--- Thread: Red Sox - Yankees - The Final Showdown (/showthread.php?tid=9473)
- The Jays - 10-21-2004
Keep Jeter, Matsui, Rivera, Posada, Cairo, Crosby, Williams, and El Duque (for use only when Ted Lily pitches). Trade everyone else.
- crx girl - 10-21-2004
and the irony is that i actually made enough money to pay for the ticket tonight. sucks its all my fault, sorry guys
- Bloody Anus - 10-21-2004
Nobody will ever remember it, and since they won Francona didn't have to answer to it, but bringing in Pedro in the 7th was the worst managerial move I have ever seen. Second guessing is always fun, but at least if I disagree with something I can understand the other side. This made absolutely no sense whatsoever. 8-1 lead, Lowe cruising with 12 groundball outs and only 69 pitches. Part of me wanted them to lose just so I could hear Francona explain the reasoning behind this. There were a ton of questionable decisions all series (Reese not pinch hitting for Bellhorn in extra inning sacrafice situations, Heredia not making an appearance in the 5th inning of game 4 with the bases loaded vs. Ortiz, not pinch running Lofton for Sierra in the 9th in game 6 representing the tying run, sending Ortiz on that SB attempt, sending Damon in the 1st inning game 7, and so on..) But at least I could understand the rationale behind them, though I may not necessarily agree with it. Bringing in Pedro on 2 days rest after throwing 100+ pitches was just mind boggling. Bringing in Ramiro Mendoza would have made more sense.
Everyone says Rodriguez had "nothing to lose" by swatting at Arroyo since he would have been out anyway. But had he not interfered, Jeter would be in scoring position for Sheffield with 2 outs. A base hit makes it 4-3, Arroyo's out, Myers comes in to pitch to Matsui representing the go-ahead run and who knows what happens then. It's those little things that make the difference.
As for Heredia, his not being a factor was the biggest factor of all in the series. Nobody was able to get Ortiz out because they have nobody to pitch to him. Same holds true for Houston should they win (Mike Gallo=Heredia)
This all proves what I've been saying for the last year.. you do NOT win championships by signing every free agent possible and making blockbuster trades all winter. They won 4 championships by building a tremendous FARM SYSTEM, then going out and picking up a not so big free agent here (Wells, Stanton etc) a not-so-big trade there (O'neill, Martinez, Brosius, Girardi, Vizcaino, Justice etc). Not by signing the best player possible at every position. Let them spend as much money as they want next year. Get Beltran, Johnson, Ryan, Kent, Beltre, Delgado, Sexson, Pavano, Benson, Clement, whoever else is available. Until this team re-establishes a farm system they're not gonna win shit.
- Galt - 10-21-2004
That Pedro move was just foolish. Even if he came in and did well, there was no point in bringing him in. He had to know it would get the crowd into the game, get the yankees into the game.
If the starter were Schilling or Arrojo or Pedro I could understand taking them out after 6 innings because he was pitching on short rest, and you don't want to burn him for the World Series that you are confident you will make since you're up by 7.
But Lowe isn't starting. He's pitching out of the bullpen. Pitch him until his arm falls off. You weren't going to need Lowe until NEXT Wednesday or Tuesday at the earliest.
It was just baffling. But Francona is well known for making retarding managerial decisions. But if anyone is going to cost the Red Sox the world series, it's Dale Svuem their 3rd Base coach. Getting Damon thrown out by 10 feet is not uncommon. The guy has had 5-10 times where he's waved people in that had no business even attempting to score.
Matsui had the ball before Damon even reached 3rd base.
- GonzoStyle - 10-21-2004
It's really become a bit sad right now, i'm not happy the yanks lost but hey they lost and thats that.
But theres some really sick fuckin people out there, I been watching cold pizza and other sports shows since the early morning.
Theres fuckin people out there acting as if their parents died or they lost everything and have no reason to live. The comments from some people are like its the most catastrophic event in their lives.
One woman said "this is worse than 9/11"
I mean fuckin seriously.
They even had a psychiatrist on espn explaining to the fans on how to cope with the depression they will experience from this loss... If you were all fine and dandy before the loss and this is what caused you to finally become depressed then I wanna live your fuckin care free life.
- Hoon - 10-21-2004
I can understand Francona's move to bring Pedro in.
I mean hey, if things did start going bad (like they did) he could always pull him with the ridiculous lead they had.
I think he brought him in because Pedro asked to be put in.
Why?
Because of what the Yankees did to Pedro last year in the ALCS.
Because of the "who's your daddy" chant.
In a basic effort to shut the yankees up.
To rub it in their faces.
Hey, I'm a Yankee fan but hats off to Boston.
They got it done. They deserve to go to the series.
Now I can finally root for these bastards to win a game.
- Galt - 10-21-2004
The guy at my office who is the most arrogant Yankee fan: not working today
My buddy who is the most arrogant Yankee fan: Not on IM today.
The Yankees have inexcusibly blown an unlosable series. To the team that makes it hurt the most. From here on out, that baggage will always be with the Yankees and their fans. No matter what happens with the World Series.
- HollywoodJewMoses - 10-21-2004
last night was absolutely incredible.
no deaths this time!
- Hoon - 10-21-2004
Yankees fans will have a redeeming factor if Houston wins tonight and the Sox make of mockery of The Pocket Rocket, Roger Clemons, in the series..
Edited By Hoon on 1098371869
- Keyser Soze - 10-21-2004
wow, that was awesome!!!
- The Jays - 10-21-2004
This series shoulda ended four days ago. Such a waste.
- The Jays - 10-21-2004
Ugh. Now the Jets at New England game is tainted by this.
- Galt - 10-21-2004
![[Image: slappy.jpg]](http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v255/Gittus/slappy.jpg)
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- The Jays - 10-21-2004
Why does he need a purse to interfer with a play?
- The Jays - 10-21-2004
One request... can someone change the topic description from "showdown" to "meltdown"? Thanx.
- Goatweed - 10-21-2004
The Jays Wrote:This series shoulda ended four days ago. Such a waste.I agree - I kind of felt like they lost it all after losing game 4.
- Keyser Soze - 10-21-2004
everytime a team goes down 3-0, the yankees will be mentioned.
forever, the 2004 yankees will be known as the biggest choke in the
history of sports.
today, you dont get to talk about 26 championships, today is the day
when fans of every team can bask in the catastrophic defeat of a
franchise that, often smugly and arrogantly, buys its way to a pennant
year in and year out.
today is the day the yankees get to know what the rest of the world feels like.
- crx girl - 10-21-2004
i thought we'd agreed that it can't be bought
- Black Lazerus - 10-21-2004
Keyser Soze Wrote:forever, the 2004 yankees will be known as the biggest choke in theThe lakers might have them beat.
history of sports.
- Keyser Soze - 10-21-2004
who the fuck are you people kidding
money isnt everything, but it damn sure puts you at a distinct advantage