CDIH

BJ, you are forgetting the atheists.

Personally, I think people are just looking for something to bitch about.

With all the shit going on in the world, don't you think this is pretty damn petty.

Can't this wait until we somewhat remove ourselves from this current state of war? I mean really, where the fuck are our priorities?

Let's define offended Keyser,
I think it might be better if it weren't there,
but I am not offended.
I am a life long Redskin fan, I don't want their name or logo changed,
yet I recognize it as being rascist as hell.

The problem BJ is the atheists (the pledge suit was brought by an atheist). The constitution is clear without room for interpretation. There is to be a seperation between church and state. Any reference to a god by the government is unconstitutional. I can respect that and the seperation issue is necessary. Without it, we can become a religious extremist nation.

I may have been more inclined to jump on this bandwagon when the stock market was through the roof and our biggest fear was getting attacked by a shark.

Our government has been full of inconsistencies,
seperation of church and state, yet it's blatant inclusion in my arms of the state.
"All men are created equal" as per a bunch of slave owners.
All we can do is recognize their genius where we can,
and improve their shortcomings where we must.
"God" wasn't such a loaded word 200 years ago. Every one in the country could identify with the christian judeo "god" but times change.

I have to agree that having words like "In God We Trust" is a violation of the church/state thing. It doesn't offend me, an atheist, but it's a violation. It's not as if it bothers me but if you want to get specific, it is a violation.

And i'm the first to admit my generation hasn't been tested. We've become sluggish and complacent. we haven't had anything major to prove ourselves, no major events to be something and if 9/11 were to be considered THE event to make men out of boys, we failed because it's really pretty much been forgotten (for lack of a better word), nothing much is different, no major changes have been implemented.

Gooch brings up an interesting arguement though.

Is it the past generation's fault that they raised us this way or are we just a product of our times?

OK, I didn't read the whole thread, but I have a statement...

I didn't have an American flag before 9/11, and I still don't. All you fucks that ran out and bought a flag are so false it sickens me.

Thank you and good day.

You may call it false....BUT! All those people at least for a minute, stood behind this country. Something that hasn't happened since the attack on Pearl Harbor. Do I hate fake patriotism? Yes. But I don't think it was fake. I think people wanted to show their support for this country.

i hate how when a small group of people have a grievance everyone is supposed to cater to them. the use of god in money and the pledge does not inflict god on anyone, and its not as if there life is made harder just because of it. its just there. whoop-di-doo. there are way to many different people in this country to comply to each one. to many people just want to 'rage against' the gov't and cause a stir for the sake of it, and this seems like a retarded time to do that.

Quote:There is to be a seperation between church and state. Any reference to a god by the government is unconstitutional. I can respect that and the seperation issue is necessary. Without it, we can become a religious extremist nation.

I agree with you 1000% about the seperation between church and state. So there in lies the problem, our on government has added the words "Under God" and "In God We Trust" and has gone against the constitution and what it stands for. Dont get me wrong, I love this country, I tried to join the Army right out of highschool, but could not because of my eye, I want to defend our freedom's. I really think alot of the problems that we are facing are because of our own damn government, and instead of the U.S. trying to police the world, yes thats what I believe, we need to work on whats going on here in our home land first.

We all sit here and bad mouth anyone who is here on a visa that bad mouths this country, but ya know what, because of all the freedoms we have, they (even though it fuckin kills me) have the right and the freedom to do so. It's called freedom of speach. I also agree that all buildings, state or fedral, should not be decorating for any type of religious holidays.. Christmas, Kwanza,Easter, All Jewish holidays( not even trying to attempt to spell any of them). Also all public schools, witch are run by the state, should not give the kids off for Christmas break,Easter break, whatever. But then again, it's been along time since I was in school, they might have changed the names to the more PC Winter, and Spring Breaks.Anyway, I think that our freedom is what makes this country as great as it is, and if someone does not want to be patriotic, sing the SSB, say the pledge, whatever that is their freedom not to. Its also those same people freedom to bad mouth the government all they want. I know we all say, If you don't like it here leave, but alas, because of all of our freedoms, thay have every right to be here and worship and pray, and bad mouth all they want.

The concept of freedom can be a very fucked up and complicated issue now can't it?

Fuck my head hurts :crackhead:

II follow you BJ, if you don't like it, don't say it. Or change God to Brahma, Allah, Buddha, Mother, Isis, Uranus, Bob, whatever the hell you want, it's a free country...why make a big deal out of NOTHING! God's not human, It's not going to care! How can a word be harmful if it's meaningless, in the case of an atheist? People have turned into litigical pussies. They can't just go along with the stupid shit for the sake of the meaning of the whole thing.




I'm up for the bartering system, I can make jewelry, I'm learning to sew so I can make clothes :-) I could survive.

Quote:I didn't have an American flag before 9/11, and I still don't. All you fucks that ran out and bought a flag are so false it sickens me.

what about those people who had an American flag on their house all year round for many years before 9/11? what about those people?

Well that's just because you rock VG.

VG, :loveya:

Quote:We've become sluggish and complacent.

:angry:

I really tried to overlook this, I did...
But I am DEEPLY offended by your choice of words, Mr. Ikea...
I am starting a pettition to have them stricken from your post...

Quote:I really tried to overlook this, I did...
But I am DEEPLY offended by your choice of words, Mr. Ikea...
I am starting a pettition to have them stricken from your post...

I thought one of the good things about America was freedom of speech and NOW in this thread about the OKness of America you are supporting censorship. I want to call you a traitor.

My point exactly...
It's just fucking stupid whining.

My sons birthday is the 4th. Just thought I'd mention that.