if you had any reservations left on Bush's genius

[Arpikarhu]

Come on. There's no question he's not a good speaker, but what he said makes sense. If anyone else said it, people wouldn't have thought twice about it.

Hey, Al Gore said he invented the internet and nobody called him on it. Watch Bush get buried for one little slip-up by an overwhelming wave of librulmediabias!

al gore was instrumental in the growth of the internet. that quote was taken out of context and almost libelously twisted by republican propogandists.

[Galt]

The only reason that Al Gore was "instrumental" in anything about the internet is that he supported business being done over it. That's it.

Now, that's all he claiimed. He worded it to sound a little more important, but he never said he invented it; not even close.

[Arpikarhu]

The only reason that Al Gore was "instrumental" in anything about the internet is that he supported business being done over it. That's it.

this is inaccurate. he was instrumental in getting funding for the research and for expansion.

[Galt]

Yeah, you are talking out of your ass. Gore said he "took the initiative in creating the Internet". That's what he said. That's a quote. To say that claiming he said he "invented" the Internet is is borderline libelous is just borderline retarded. Media, as they tend to do, misquoted him to make him sound foolish (when it's a democrat, it's the republican attack dogs; when it's a republican, it's the liberal media bias -- in fact, the press just feeds off negativity and fear)

But I'm surprised. I didn't think he said something so foolish. I thought it was a big exaggeration on the media's part. Of course what he meant was that he took the initiative in creating the Internet "as we now know it". But even seems debatable I was positive that he sponsored the bill that deregulated the Internet for commerce; he didn't even do that.

Sure, he talked about it, but I couldn't find anything that he sponsored (admitedly only a cursory search) that materially affected the Internet's growth. But I'm sure since Apri always does his research, he's sure to link a bunch of articles right about now.



Edited By Galt on 1091763810

[Sir O]

Start your research here

And yes, I know Gore never said he invented the internet...that was my point.

[Arpikarhu]

Yeah, you are talking out of your ass. Gore said he "took the initiative in creating the Internet". That's what he said. That's a quote. To say that claiming he said he "invented" the Internet is is borderline libelous is just borderline retarded. Media, as they tend to do, misquoted him to make him sound foolish (when it's a democrat, it's the republican attack dogs; when it's a republican, it's the liberal media bias -- in fact, the press just feeds off negativity and fear)

But I'm surprised. I didn't think he said something so foolish. I thought it was a big exaggeration on the media's part. Of course what he meant was that he took the initiative in creating the Internet "as we now know it". But even seems debatable I was positive that he sponsored the bill that deregulated the Internet for commerce; he didn't even do that.

Sure, he talked about it, but I couldn't find anything that he sponsored (admitedly only a cursory search) that materially affected the Internet's growth. But I'm sure since Apri always does his research, he's sure to link a bunch of articles right about now.

you say that i am talking out my ass and then prove my point. interesting ploy.

[Galt]

how did I prove your point? I said (before you said it) that Gore never said that. However, what he said was a lot closer to what was quoted than I thought. I also said that he wasn't integral in making the Internet open for business (I thought he had), so how did I prove any of your points?

[GonzoStyle]

being a great speaker is one thing, not proof reading is just plain lazy.

[Galt]

I would wager that there is not a president in the last 20 years who proofread any but the most important prepared speeches (state of the union, convention, etc). They just don't have the time. That's what speechwriters are for.

Even if he did have time to proofread, it wouldn't matter. He's a horrible speaker. He's sounds like a total moron.

[Keyser Soze]

i just dont trust someone that stupid to run the country, call me crazy. sure the media plays a part in pushing that image forward, but i dont think bush needs much help.

[Sir O]

I also said that he wasn't integral in making the Internet open for business (I thought he had)

From the link I posted...

Al Gore and the Internet

By Robert Kahn and Vinton Cerf

Al Gore was the first political leader to recognize the importance of the Internet and to promote and support its development.

No one person or even small group of persons exclusively "invented" the Internet. It is the result of many years of ongoing collaboration among people in government and the university community. But as the two people who designed the basic architecture and the core protocols that make the Internet work, we would like to acknowledge VP Gore's contributions as a Congressman, Senator and as Vice President. No other elected official, to our knowledge, has made a greater contribution over a longer period of time.

Last year the Vice President made a straightforward statement on his role. He said: "During my service in the United States Congress I took the initiative in creating the Internet." We don't think, as some people have argued, that Gore intended to claim he "invented" the Internet. Moreover, there is no question in our minds that while serving as Senator, Gore's initiatives had a significant and beneficial effect on the still-evolving Internet. The fact of the matter is that Gore was talking about and promoting the Internet long before most people were listening. We feel it is timely to offer our perspective.

As far back as the 1970s Congressman Gore promoted the idea of high speed telecommunications as an engine for both economic growth and the improvement of our educational system. He was the first elected official to grasp the potential of computer communications to have a broader impact than just improving the conduct of science and scholarship. Though easily forgotten, now, at the time this was an unproven and controversial concept. Our work on the Internet started in 1973 and was based on even earlier work that took place in the mid-late 1960s. But the Internet, as we know it today, was not deployed until 1983. When the Internet was still in the early stages of its deployment, Congressman Gore provided intellectual leadership by helping create the vision of the potential benefits of high speed computing and communication. As an example, he sponsored hearings on how advanced technologies might be put to use in areas like coordinating the response of government agencies to natural disasters and other crises.

As a Senator in the 1980s Gore urged government agencies to consolidate what at the time were several dozen different and unconnected networks into an "Interagency Network." Working in a bi-partisan manner with officials in Ronald Reagan and George Bush's administrations, Gore secured the passage of the High Performance Computing and Communications Act in 1991. This "Gore Act" supported the National Research and Education Network (NREN) initiative that became one of the major vehicles for the spread of the Internet beyond the field of computer science.

As Vice President Gore promoted building the Internet both up and out, as well as releasing the Internet from the control of the government agencies that spawned it. He served as the major administration proponent for continued investment in advanced computing and networking and private sector initiatives such as Net Day. He was and is a strong proponent of extending access to the network to schools and libraries. Today, approximately 95% of our nation's schools are on the Internet. Gore provided much-needed political support for the speedy privatization of the Internet when the time arrived for it to become a commercially-driven operation.

There are many factors that have contributed to the Internet's rapid growth since the later 1980s, not the least of which has been political support for its privatization and continued support for research in advanced networking technology. No one in public life has been more intellectually engaged in helping to create the climate for a thriving Internet than the Vice President. Gore has been a clear champion of this effort, both in the councils of government and with the public at large.

The Vice President deserves credit for his early recognition of high speed computing and communication and for his long-term and consistent articulation of the potential value of the Internet to American citizens and industry and, indeed, to the rest of the world.


Robert Kahn and Vinton Cerf are two of the primary pioneers of the internet, co-designers of the TCP/IP protocol and winners of numerous awards, including the 1997 National Medal of Technology.

[Arpikarhu]

i stand vindicated.

once again galts bluster and accusations cant hide the fact that he usually has strong opinions on matters he doesnt know much about.

[Galt]

I don't know what your point is. That doesn't address what I said at all.

I know there's a knee-jerk prove the conservative wrong because he must be bashing the liberal mentality here. I'm not saying that Gore wasn't an intellectual leader in the space, or denying that he was one of the leading supporters of the Internet's growth.

I had two points

1. That he said "took the initiative of creating the Internet" is a not close to accurate. If ANYONE can actually claim to have create it; it's not him. Maybe he simply misspoke, but it still doesn't make it less wrong. The original point of the thread was on speaking gaffes. This was a big one. He didn't say what he meant; he sounded foolish. "invent" "create" it's really not much different. He did neither.

2. That there was a bill in the 1993/1994 timeframe that specifically opened the Internet net up to allow copanies to actually transact business over the Internet. I thought Gore sponsored THAT bill, which he did not. And if ANYTHING can really be pointed to as the catalyst for Internet growth, it's that.

[Arpikarhu]

now his normal strategy of changing his story and making claims that arent true to cover his blunder emerges right on schedule.

so predictable.

[Sir O]

2. That there was a bill in the 1993/1994 timeframe that specifically opened the Internet net up to allow copanies to actually transact business over the Internet. I thought Gore sponsored THAT bill, which he did not. And if ANYTHING can really be pointed to as the catalyst for Internet growth, it's that.

Since he said, "During my service in the United States Congress, I took the initiative in creating the Internet," wouldn't common sense dictate that he wasn't talking about a bill that was signed when he was VP?

[Arpikarhu]

2. That there was a bill in the 1993/1994 timeframe that specifically opened the Internet net up to allow copanies to actually transact business over the Internet. I thought Gore sponsored THAT bill, which he did not. And if ANYTHING can really be pointed to as the catalyst for Internet growth, it's that.

Since he said, "During my service in the United States Congress, I took the initiative in creating the Internet," wouldn't common sense dictate that he wasn't talking about a bill that was signed when he was VP?

quiet! you are gonna blow galt's concentration. he is working it!

[Galt]

well now that's a solid point. No wonder I couldn't find it. Luckily I'm a better person than Arpi and can admit when I am wrong..

Arpi could have clearly defeated me in this debate had he realized my foolishness regarding the dates. But he cmopletely ignored my specific point about not backing that specific bill, and just rambled about how much of a thought leader Gore was on the Internet, which I never disagreed with.

As it is, I'd much prefer Sir O point out my failings so I can retain my undefeated streak vs. Arpi.

And let us not forget the fact that gore said that he "took the initiative in creating the Internet", which is at best, dramatically stretching the truth. Ther ewas no republican spin machine making it up. There was nothing borderline liebleous about it. Gore said it; it was foolish. It's not what he meant, I would imagine. But when politicians speak in public ever day for hours at a time, they're going to say foolish things. It's the law of averages. It's just a matter of what the press chooses to focus on.

[Galt]

my computer/cabel modem/whatever at home is so damn slow that my keyboard is always delayed and that's why I have so many friggin spelling errors. The information errors however, are unforgivable.

And looking back on this thread, what was a "strong opinion" I repeatedly said that I thought something and was mistaken, that things were still debatable,that I only did a cursory search. I'm a good person.

[Arpikarhu]

Luckily I'm a better person than Arpi and can admit when I am wrong..

....As it is, I'd much prefer Sir O point out my failings so I can retain my undefeated streak vs. Arpi.

like you admitted you were wrong about the HDI thing? i think not

let's recap shall we:

1. galt wrong about my imclone profit
2. galt wrong about HDI
3. galt wrong here

galt 0 for 3


now prepare for more bluster in which galt reuses old lies and mistakes in the hope that time has made them the truth in some peoples minds.

[crx girl]

get over it already


i just wanted to say, what would we ever do without sir o with all the backups