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| Posted By | Discussion Topic: Should Bush Have Approves Military Tribunals | ||||
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| o&aswallow | posted on 11-14-2001 @ 11:44 AM |    | |||
| O&A Board Regular Registered: Jan. 01  | MSNBC NEWS SERVICES Nov. 14 — President Bush has authorized use of special military tribunals to try noncitizens accused of terrorism, enabling trials to proceed with greater secrecy than in a conventional court, and much more quickly, lawyers in and out of government said. “These are extraordinary times and the president wants to have as many options as possible,†Mindy Tucker, Justice Department spokeswoman. THE ORDER, which the president signed Tuesday before leaving for Crawford, Texas, gives the Bush administration another avenue to bring terrorists to justice, White House counsel Albert Gonzales said. “This is a new tool to use against terrorism,†Gonzales said in a telephone interview. Gonzales, a former Texas Supreme Court judge who is the president’s top lawyer, said a military commission could have several advantages over a civilian court. It is easier to protect the sources and methods of investigators in military proceedings, for example, and a military trial can be held overseas. Convicted terrorists might also be executed shortly after a trial, with few or none of the long delays for additional court appeals common in criminal courts, lawyers said. OK, for the most part I am a hawkish , fuck'em blow them off the face of the earth person. But I also am very fond of protecting the constitution and the principles on which it was founded. I also am very concerned of the "boiling frog principle" of erroding our rights and stretching the constitution one step at a time. Granted, I am no Dubya fan and Ashcroft scares the hell out of me, but is this going too far? Your thoughts?  American Patriot, Pennsylvania resident, but original NYC listener. This message was edited by o&aswallow on 11-14-01 @ 11:46 AM | ||||
| GonzoStyle | posted on 11-14-2001 @ 11:48 AM | | |||
| Hanger-On Registered: Jan. 70 | Thanks teenweek, I think assigning a tribunal was a good move. It worked well during the trials at Nuremberg after WW2. Plus it brings the poignant reminder of the loss of life that was suffered in parallel with WW2 and on 9/11. Plus The similarity that these crimes were not just crimes against the USA but crimes upon humanity itself like in WW2. It was not just jews who died in those camps. But polish jews, russian jews, chech jews, british jews, french jews and citizens of the world as did in the WTC. people of many different cultures and societies died in those buildings on 9/11. So I am all for the tribunals, the numerical loss off life at the WTC can not even be compared to the loss of life in WW2, but the message can be.  I'm Deep Inside Your Children. They Will Betray You In MY Name. She-Mail Me Here | ||||
| Arthur Dent | posted on 11-14-2001 @ 12:05 PM | | |||
| O&A Board Regular Registered: Nov. 00 | Two things concern me. 1. The idea that a military court can be conducted in secret. Nuremberg was a VERY public proceeding. It HAD to be to prove that we, and the world, were acting FAIRLY and MORALLY. How do we prove to the Muslim world that we are acting from the moral high ground if the trials are secret? 2. Are we saying the terrorists are soldiers and not criminals? After all, isn't a military court for military crimes? Are we adding to the terrorists "credibility" in their home countries by trying them in a military court? | ||||
| GonzoStyle | posted on 11-14-2001 @ 12:15 PM | | |||
| Hanger-On Registered: Jan. 70 | Well they are being tried for crimes against humanity hence forth they are being tried in a court before the world. I am not concerned with these petty problems of who they are being tried as, but that they are being tried for the worst possible crimes. My biggest concern is that unlike at nuremberg which sent almost 3/4's of the defendants to their deaths. This tribunal will not in all probability in this bullshit politically correct society have the luxury of sentencing these scum to death. The fact that they want to keep it is secret is they can want all they want but the public demand will call for this trial to be public no matter what they want. I'm Deep Inside Your Children. They Will Betray You In MY Name. She-Mail Me Here | ||||
| o&aswallow | posted on 11-14-2001 @ 12:25 PM | | |||
| O&A Board Regular Registered: Jan. 01 | quote: Ouch! Does this meen I will not make the today I love the o&aswallow list? GS, I agree 100% with making sure that the guilty pay for crimes against humanity. But since WWII, the civilized world has instituted world courts to deal with these matters. I believe in some respect that the main reason for doing this is so that if we fuck up and capture bin Laden alive, we will be able to bring him to trial, convict and execute him instead of having to turn him over to a muslim court. The article that I quoted here goes on to point out from the ACLU that by constitutional law, the only way that the president can approve a military tribunal is to prove and justify why sitting courts could not do the job. American Patriot, Pennsylvania resident, but original NYC listener. | ||||
| barch97 BBTB The barch gots lots a dick I kind of enjoy my anonymity on the board WOW Forum Ambassador | posted on 11-14-2001 @ 12:52 PM | | |||
| O&A Board Veteran Registered: Jul. 00 | Isn't it the idea that we need to protect "their" rights what started this all in the first place? They're not US citizens. Our constitution doesn't apply to them. They have no rights. If they didn't want to be executed, they shouldn't have blown up our buildings. Sure, it's scary to think that whackjobs like Dubya & Ashcroft could try this at home as well. And, I'm not convinced that they're not trying to implement similar policies here. It sounds like the primary reason for this is to speed the proccess along. To which I say "What's the big F-in' hurry?" I've been seeing far too much of this irrational arguement since September 11th. I think it was Anthony himself that said: "Let's hurry up and bomb them before we come to our senses." I don't want to sound like a conspiracy theorist here but, why are we all so willing all of a sudden to believe everything the government tells us? I think my favorite thing about life in the wake of this tragedy is that I've been afforded the oppertunity to through the favorite historic quote of the NRA right back at them on so many occasions: "They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." Benjamin Franklin Yeah, even I am confused by this post.  Long Live the "Syndication Underground" | ||||
| Snoteater | posted on 11-14-2001 @ 12:56 PM | | |||
| Psychopath Registered: Apr. 01 | In a word YES. I know it goes against all my liberal being, but what happened on 9/11 was an act of war. And if we caught some of these bastards, they should be tried in military fashion. We also have to look out for our intelligence people & protocal. If this was to be held in a regular court, we'll have the media poking there nose where they don't belong. This is one of the things I'm not supposed to know about(our intelligence practices)as a regular american citizen. I certianly hope that the Military tribunals will off the bastards if they are found guilty. I know it won't bring back the people I worked with, but it will make me feel a little better.  | ||||
| NJopposition | posted on 11-14-2001 @ 1:01 PM | | |||
| Psychopath Registered: May. 01 | gonzo, even though there are PC factions in this country, bush right now has a 90% approval rating, and im sure if we arrested and tried these scumfuck Taliban and Al Queda leaders and sentenced them to death more than 90% of Americans would not only agree with it, but go out in the streets and cheer.... | ||||
| TeenWeek what's a status? | posted on 11-14-2001 @ 1:43 PM | | |||
| O&A Board Regular Registered: Oct. 00 | quote: Hey I have been good for almost 3 weeks now. The only news story I posted was that Michael Jackson thinks he has anthrax. God, what does a guy have to do to shake the cnn label off.  | ||||
| Sephiroth | posted on 11-14-2001 @ 2:20 PM | | |||
| O&A Board Regular Registered: Dec. 00 | They set up the military tribunal for 2 simple reasons. 1) Bringing the terrorists here creates a significant security problem. It makes any courtroom where they will be tried a target. And, it is almost impossible to find a fair and impartial jury/judge to preside over the case. 2) Making the proceedings secret allows the Military and CIA to protect the identities of the informants they have place within Afghanistan, the Taliban, and possibly with Al Quaeda. By protecting the informants and the methods they use to gather informantion, we can also protect our intelligence feeds.
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| barch97 BBTB The barch gots lots a dick I kind of enjoy my anonymity on the board WOW Forum Ambassador | posted on 11-14-2001 @ 2:23 PM | | |||
| O&A Board Veteran Registered: Jul. 00 | quote:So, this was just deliberate missinformation? Long Live the "Syndication Underground" | ||||
Displaying 1-11 of 11 messages in this thread. |